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Saturday, 08 March 2008

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Goat

Excellent work Heidi, I was going to suggest the Patriot Post as a fantastic resource but you got to it a couple paragraphs after that thought. You are correct that we are not a true democracy as I believe it was Franklin that pointed out that only leads to mob rule on the whims of the uninformed masses and why we are a Constitutional Republic of democratically elected representatives to offer a check on mob rule. Richard Brookhiser wrote an excellent biography about Alexander Hamilton that went into the Constitutional Convention and Federalist Papers in great detail that I highly recommend. I look forward to the rest of your series and will have to some studying up on the subject as it is always worth refreshing the mind to our founding principles.

gayle

My only comment is "WOW, Heidianne! Good job! You certainly have done your homework well. :)

heidianne jackson

i NEED that book, thanks for letting me know, goat. part two should go up sometime tomorrow night or monday morning. i LOVE the patriot post - been reading them since thei inception when they were known as the federalist patriot...

heidianne jackson

thanks gayle, glad you stopped by...

Goat

You are welcome Heidi, it is a great read the title is "Alexander Hamilton, American". I have been reading the Patriot since I got a computer about six years ago and have saved every issue since and it is my main resource for historical documents or anything Reagan.

Southern Sage

Followed fromyour comment on Dana's.
I think your right on.
Didn't get to read this whole post but I'll be back.

Southern Sage

oh yeah
right click
add to faves.

Angel

the constitution of the united states of america became the law of the land BEFORE the first ten amendments to the constitution had even been written....what a super , well researched project u got goin here Heidi...keep it up girl!:)

Otto - American Interests

Both an enlightening and educational post Heidi, truly excellent work; it is sad that the education system appears to disregard such a significant and valuable document. I think the best thing for me to do is to sit back and take it in, as you post. I know some about modern America (past 100 or so years) but sadly, too little of, or about the era of which you write. I look forward to lesson two…

Jess

I concur with the others, that was a great summation Heidi!

Also before I post here, book mark this site if you haven't:

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/

I've used this as a resource for some time in connection with my studies of History, it's a one stop for the important documents in American and world history! I love it!

Ok now, I'm a 38 year old History major (yes I am STILL in college LOL) with my sights set on a career in a number of areas including teaching high school history (MY way!), having my own syndicated column, or some career which involves EDUCATING people about the history of our country and the importance of preserving their rights (and of course, knowledge of the responsibilities that come with those rights), I really enjoyed reading what you wrote and I love history. I think that there is just no way to forge ahead and improve society and make things better without knowing the history of HOW WE GOT TO THIS POINT in the first place!!!!

I'm in midterm of my US History to 1877 and we just--I mean JUST finished section III which covers everything you just covered! You must be in my head. And so I really enjoyed reading this!

I agree that the Constitution was definitely supported by DOI, Federalist/antifederalist papers, and Articles of Confederation (sure it was weak, but it was something). And I think that others added to it as well. We have the Constitutions of the thirteen colonies, the Declaration of the Causes and Necessity of Taking up Arms, Thomas Paine's common sense and a whole host of other written masterpieces.

Someone called into a talk radio program the other day, another great American who is just disgusted with the power of our central government and the slow but sure gradual eradication of the rights of the states and the individual. He claimed that the Declaration of Independence calls for abolishing the old government and instituting a new one if the government (in so many words) doesn't serve the people.

I agree with him.

The host however, remarked that isn't remarked anywhere in the Constitution and as such would be illegal and seen as treasonous.

Now I believe that as Americans we have a responsibility to preserve and protect the rights of the Constitution and all the ideals which make it up. That mode of thinking is not treasonous--it is not treasonous to want to preserve LIBERTY and FREEDOM. But of course if it's deemed unconstitutional then it is. WTF? I don't get it.

Liberty and freedom such as we enjoy cannot last forever.It's all a cycle. I believe that eventually it ends--a free nation eventually becomes a dictatorship, throw in some anarchy, revolution and eventually the people become free again but getting there takes a long time. I see this circle going round and round, each phase lasting perhaps a hundred or few hundred years. Look at what we have now and where we're going. It's not treasonous to see it for what it is. We began with no country, people migrating here for a better life, the desire for freedom, war with England, a Declaration of Independence, winning the war against the tyranny of the King, freedom, weak Articles, a strong Constitution, industrial revolution, more wars, freeing nations around the world of tyranny, technological revolution, battling terrorists, loss of freedom in exchange for security, and eventual loss of freedom completely. That hasn't happened yet but it will, probably not in our lifetime but again I believe it's part of the inevitable cycle. After that it's revolt, war, and it starts all over again.

Anyway I digress. Sure, the overthrowing of one's government if it is not serving the people, is not in my opinion treasonous, it is in fact upholding the ideals of the Constitution. After all the Declaration of Independence which was a major basis of the Constitution. Are we to dismiss what's in the DOI because it's not an "official legal document?"

Those who dismiss the importance of documents preceding the Constitution because they say these documents are not the basis for the government of our country are wrong. It's the ideals within these documents that helped create the Constitution. So if they are invalid, so is the Constitution. Without them there would have been no Constitution.

Which of course is why it angers me so that public high school students are robbed of a solid foundation for the history of their country because they don't understand the whole MEANING of the Constitution, which is not just what is stated in it but WHY it is stated and how it came to be.

Anyway sorry for the rant.

:) Jess


ps...a good read is the "Essential Thomas Jefferson" which is a book containing letters he wrote over the years. The man was brilliant, just brilliant.

Let's ask ourselves why the brilliance of yesterday is just not present today. These men of our past weren't perfect, not at all, but their thinking, their intelligence, their foresight---is like nothing I've ever seen in politics during my lifetime. If it exists, then someone please point me in the direction!

Mustang

This is an EXCEPTIONAL post! You may also be interested in reading James Madison's notes, compiled and published by Robert J. Morgan and Greenwood Press. His work is called, "James Madison on the Constitution and the Bill of Rights."

There can be no "unhindered" progress as long as Americans continue to be brainwashed, rather than educated. This means more than "book learning." It also encompasses American civics, but this tradition has been distilled through multiculturalism. We cannot maintain a proud and distinct American culture if our children are told that Americans are no better than anyone else. If anyone believes that, they cannot reinforce our values.

I am looking forward to your continuation.

Semper Fi

courtneyme109

Whoa! Heidianne! Thanks so much for this. Americans tend to forget this awesome place we have was NOT fixed up in 2 minutes from a microwave. THis is great stuff.

heidianne jackson

sage, thanks for stopping by and welcome! i'll be over at your place a bit later tonight.

heidianne jackson

thanks angel, i'm learning right along with everyone else in some regards!

heidianne jackson

well, otto, all that i know about the history of australia is pitifully too little. i have been striving increase my knowledge, but it's slow going. any books, to that end that you can recommend?

heidianne jackson

jess, no need to apologize - i end up doing the same thing when i go some place and there's something up that i'm passionate about. i have bookmarked the incredible site you've give me - and i'm in the midst of reading the tj book. it's awesome!

thanks for stopping by, please correct me if i put up anything wrong!

heidianne jackson

mustang, thanks so much for stopping in. i wholeheartedly agree with your assessment and am saddened that so many in our midst our blind to it. great book on james madison, by all accounts. it's on my list to read and i hope to soon!

heidianne jackson

courtney, such high praise from you, girl. it is amazing how many of us, even on the right side of the fence, are clueless as to what it took to formulate the country as we have it now... thanks for stopping in - on my way to your place shortly!

Jess

Ahh you're reading that book? Wow! Great minds think alike. I bought the book about 14 years ago and it's among my favorites!

You know who I find really interesting besides Jefferson? Alexander Hamilton and Henry Clay. Brilliant men!!!!

But that's for another day!

Southern Sage

come on by anytime, I like when thinkers opine.

Robert (conservative commentary)

Exceptional post Heidi! I find the history of the Constitution, and the varying opinions about how our government should have been structured most interesting. There is no finer social experiment than American democracy, and it is telling that so many desire to be here, despite our continual arguments over taxation and separation of powers.

I find it unfortunate that so many never seem to learn about our history, and this important period in not only American history, but how those discussions among a relatively few men in the colonies eventually created the substantial impact on the rest of the world. Had it not been for the Great Compromise, how many countries would not be free from oppresion today?

Don't tell anyone, but my daughter has a history teacher who does not teach from the book. He has impressed her with his knowledge of things "in between" the dates of modern history, and the stories that are never reflected in the accounts of textbooks. He would probably lose his job....

Goat

Jess, the Constitution backs up the DoI as our founding document by providing the parameters of a Federal Republic and not the other way around. The Federalist Papers do back up the Con. which clarified the Articles of Confederation. The Anti-Federalist Papers argued against the Constitution.

heidianne jackson

robert, so glad to see you at my place again - it's been a long time...

it's a shame that a teacher capable of capturing the minds of his students has to hope that no one finds out he's straying from the books. he should be rewarded!

heidianne jackson

goat, my dear friend, it is not enough to say that the anti-federalist papers argued against the constitution. while in point of fact this is true, you are missing the biggest outcome of the anti-federalist papers: our own bill of rights. more on that in a future post!

Jess

Hey Goat, please understand that my point was that the anti-federalists were instrumental in the formation of the Bill of Rights. The opinions and ideals of the anti-federalists were as important and had as much influence as that of the federalists. Without the anti-federalists we would not have had a Bill of Rights.

:) Jess

Goat

Jess and Heidi, good point on the AFP that I had forgotten, it has been a few years since I dug into them. I stand corrected.

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